Date: Sun, 28 Apr 1996 06:43:09 +0200
From: Julie Mayo <>
Subject: Re:

LRH and I

On Wed, 24 Apr 1996 20:23:17 UTC, (David Cooke) wrote:


<noticed how the situation improved from 1983 onwards. According
<to Ron's Journal 38 again, this sudden boom was general around
<the world. It followed on the departure from the admin and tech
<areas of many people whom L. Ron Hubbard regarded as

Did L. Ron Hubbard consider me to be a suppressive? If so, he never told me so. The first thing I recall LRH calling me was a "trouper".
That was in 1974 after I had done a mission which was to carry out an eval that he had done personally. As I recall, the mission was rewarded the status of "Power".

A year or two later L. Ron Hubbard ordered that I be appointed to the post of CS 4, which was his personal aide for technical matters.

(Do you think COST has preserved L. Ron Hubbard's dispatches concerning the above?)

In 1980, I became Senior C/S INT Assistant. One of the first things that I did as Senior C/S INT Assistant was to help David Mayo write Solo NOTs. In fact, part of the original SOLO NOTs checksheet was written by yours truly. Hubbard wasn't around Gilman Hot Springs at that time. He was in seclusion with the Broekers.

In late 1981, LRH began communicating with David Mayo, Senior C/S INT, and the CMO and his personal accountants. From 1981 until August of 1982, David Mayo and the Senior C/S INT Office received many messages and letters from LRH. Amongst other things, LRH suggested that David develop a Happiness Rundown, which David did. When the rundown and course were completed, auditors and C/Ses from around the world came to ASHO in LA. David personally taught the course and internship. It was a huge success.

If LRH was pleased with a person, and thought that a person was successful in carrying out projects, it was LRH's habit to then give that person many more projects to do. Such was the case of the Senior C/S INT office in 1982. We were swamped with projects. LRH was praising our work over and over again and offering various suggestions and comments concerning technical matters.

(These letters from L. Ron Hubbard to David Mayo must have been preserved by COST as they would be very important indeed. There may have been some "third party" concerning David and I which has colored people's opinion of us, but surely the words of L. Ron Hubbard concerning such an important topic as the Bridge would have been preserved. Wouldn't you agree?)

In April 1982, L. Ron Hubbard sent a very long and detailed letter to David Mayo concerning the future of the tech. A copy of the letter was sent to a good many other people: I was on the list, as Senior C/S INT Assistant; also CO CMO INT (John Nelson, at the time); Maureen Samuels (who was either CO CMO SU of CO CMO GOLD); and several others.

In the letter LRH did some reminiscing concerning his long term association with David and David's extensive experience concerning the tech. LRH said that he expected to live for 2 years longer at the most, and that he wanted David to take over all of his technical hats, including research. LRH said he thought that David should have a separate corporation to do this work, apart from Scientology management.

LRH also wrote to Lyman Spurlock concerning setting up a separate corporation for David Mayo and his technical research. Lyman Spurlock was a CPA and had graduated from UC Berkeley, I believe, so was the Sea Org member who had the most knowledge concerning finances and corporate matters.

In August the Senior C/S INT Office was very, very busy as we had many projects. We were receiving letters from LRH almost daily, commending us, and advising even more projects. One night, David and I worked late to finish one of the projects so that it could be sent up to LRH. This particular project had to do with Div 6 -- new public.

I hadn't been asleep long when I was awoken by Marc Yager and taken to meet David Miscavige at the Senior C/S INT Office. David Miscavige put me into the RPF -- as I detailed in my letter to D. Miscavige which I posted on ars last week. You may have seen it.

Being placed under guard, incommunicado, was a big surprise to me because we had apparently, according to letters from LRH, been doing splendidly. If there was an order from LRH to put me in the RPF, I never saw it, and nobody told me about it.

I was put on a running program for 12 hours a day, 7 days a week, and made to run around a tree in all types of extreme desert conditions. In October of 1982, a Scientology "Committee of Evidence" was issued on me and 15 other well-respected Scientologists. This "Committee of Evidence" had apparently already found us guilty of ridiculously outrageous things, before the committee was ever convened. If you haven't seen the issue, you really must read it. It was a rather long FCO, but I'll see if I can post some excerpts for you, in a separate posting.

I remember the moment I first saw it vividly because I couldn't believe what I was reading. My knees were shakey, but I had to keep running around that tree. Johnny Schlessinger, who was also in the RPF and running around the same tree kept teasing: "I knew you were working for the KGB all along."

Things got even more bizarre. One night soon thereafter I was awoken in the middle of the night after a hard day of running, and escorted to "Qual" in the old spa building. It was around 2 or 3 AM. There were several people already assembled and waiting. The 16 of us who were being "comm-eved" were each going to be interviewed individually by three top members of RTC: Vicki Aznaran, (President of RTC), Jessie Prince, (whom. I think, was also an officer of RTC), and Geoff Shervell (formerly of the G.O. and now with RTC).

Finally, it was my turn. I was taken into a small "auditing" room and sat opposite from the three who faced me. I was told that unless I confessed to working for the IRS, FBI, or other government agency, I was going to:
A) be sent to jail
B) lose my eternity
C) be banned from tech lines forever.
When I said I didn't work for a government agency, I was told that they might go lighter on me if I confessed to supplying Alan Walters with a mailing list. I said I hadn't done that either, so was told to go think about it and write my confession.

Finally, after several hours, I was allowed to go back to sleep. But the experience was chilling. The weeks dragged on or shall I say, "ran on"? I met with the Committee of Evidence on a couple different occasions. An investigation had been done which had prompted the Committee of Evidence, but I wasn't allowed to see the investigation.

I gathered that the investigation had been done by Gelda Mithoff. Gelda Mithoff was also a member of the Committee of Evidence. The Chairman of the Committee of Evidence was Ray Mithoff. Gelda apparently had done a secret investigation which had resulted in David Mayo and myself being removed from our positions and which had inserted Ray Mithoff, her husband, as the new Senior C/S International. To make things worse, our only recourse was the Committee of Evidence, which was chaired by Ray Mithoff. David Miscavige had ordered the Scientology Committee of Evidence and his wife, Shelly, was a member of the committee.

It was just me alone with the committee (which had about 7 members). I had no representation and I had no opportunity to present my side of the story. I wasn't even allowed to see or know of the investigation which had put me in this position. I was still being guarded and was not allowed to talk to the rest of the staff or even make a phone call.

The Committee of Evidence didn't have any evidence against me. If you haven't seen the Findings and Recommendations of the Committee of Evidence, I'll try to find a copy and post some excerpts for you. I think I may have pleaded guilty to "hats, not wearing", or something to try to appease the committee. I always felt a bit guilty of that, because I was always behind on executing LRH orders.

The Committee of Evidence tried to get me to say that I had "mutual out ruds" with David Mayo. (Meaning I agreed with his disagreements.) This would have explained why I had proposed a C/S to run him on "Effects of an R/Ser" checklist. I explained this in my posting concerning letter to D. Miscavige. I don't remember if I actually did assess the "Effects of an R/Ser Checklist", I think he wasn't interested in it when I inquired. I did fly the ruds, though.

Finally I was called into the Committee of Evidence for the last time. There was a sign in front of Ray Mithoff which read: "You could be sent to the pokey for two years."

I asked Ray Mithoff on what basis I could be sent to the pokey, and he said something about having committed some "out tech" or done something that was "off policy". I couldn't believe that I could be sent to jail based on that allegation -- but I wasn't in a good position to prevent it if they decided to frame me on something. I had only about $200 in savings and was being kept under guard.

It was at this time that I knew I *had* to leave and as fast as I could. I wrote a CSW asking to leave. By this time there were security fences surrounding Gilman Hot Springs with electronically locked gates. The only way that you could get through the gates was to have a personalized card. I didn't have a card; my card had been confiscated.

In response to my CSW, I was taken to the security office where I met with Rick Aznaran who was the boss of the security guards. Rick asked me where I would go if I were to leave and I said to Orange County. Rick immediately was suspicious. I hadn't realized at that time that John Nelson had gone to Orange County. I truthfully told Rick that I wanted to go to Orange County because I had a cousin there, but if the idea concerned him, I could go somewhere else. I was intimidated by the interview because the security office was full of guns. In other times when I'd been in the office there had not been any guns. I was getting more and more worried about what was going to happen.

I waited almost two weeks for an answer to my CSW -- hoping that I would be released. No answer came. So I decided I would try to escape on my own. By this time it was January 1983 -- 6 months since I was initially put under guard. We had been moved in from Happy Valley and I was staying with about 5 other woman in a small cottage. Our group was kept separate from the other staff -- we ate after everyone else had eaten and worked in a garage at night. It was dark and damp and cold where we were working. I think we were supposed to be chipping paint or rust, but mainly they were just keeping us occupied. We went to bed around 3 or 4 in the morning.

One night I went to bed but did not go to sleep. I stayed awake until around 8:00 AM. I cautiously got down from my top bunk and gathered up a few meager possessions into a pillow case. I thought that I might be able to get through the gate when the guards went across the road to breakfast. I crept out of the cottage and waited until I saw someone go through the gate, then I slipped through it before it shut.

Now the task was to walk down the road without being noticed. I had to get by two guard booths. I slung my pillow case over my shoulder and walked casually. I wanted people to think that I was just a staff member going off to do their laundry, so I wouldn't arouse suspicion. My heart was pounding, but nobody noticed me.

After I got about a half mile down the road, I stuck out my thumb and hitch hiked to Hemet. I was in luck: within about 5 minutes someone picked me up and I made it to the bus station without incident. But the bus wasn't there and I had quite a long wait on the bench. I was worried that I would be noticed by a Scientology staff member and, sure enough, I was. Bridget Lantz stopped and said, "Are you supposed to be here?" I quickly replied, "Yes!" She looked doubtful, but drove off.

The bus did finally come, but at the same time, so did two security guards. Bridget must have tipped them off. "Julie! Come here!" They shouted. It was too late. I already had a foot on the bus, and there was no way that they could force me to go with them.

>But the great majority of Scientologists don't leave when things
>get tough. They don't expect it to be all fun and free
>hamburgers. You probably recognise the quote ""We're not playing
>some minor game in Scientology. It isn't cute or something to do
>for lack of something better". I've had a relatively soft trip
>over the bridge (pc route, never on staff) but I've known many
>people who devote their whole lives to changing the direction
>this society is going and improving life for us all. They work
>their guts out for others. They don't worry about having fun,

What can I say? No, being falsely imprisoned wasn't fun. I don't think it was cute either. I *have* dedicated my life to helping mankind. That is a big reason why I am trying to write about my personal experiences. Knowledge helps people.

>though I always get the impression they find plenty to smile
>about. People like Peter Sparshott, the C/S at AOSH ANZO, for
>example. Perhaps you knew Fred Schraitle, who would have been at
>Flag around your time there. And just the other week I saw a post
>from Melbourne's loudest anti-scientologist that insulted another
>one, Pat Wilson.

Sorry, don't know these people. Someone sent me a copy of "International Scientology News" which I read yesterday. I carefully looked over the various executive staff to see if there was anyone that I knew that hadn't left. I found a few people. (RTC was noticeably absent.) The Danilovichs in the UK, Ron Norton of Flag Management, Claire Parz I knew well. Although I haven't had any contact with them since 1980, I can say that when I knew these people they were extremely nice and certainly dedicated. I met Rae Mathieson, now of Eastern US, a couple times in England in the '70s. He is Scottish and had a wonderful sense of humor. I hope he still has it! I'd call these people "troupers", wouldn't you? Of course I recognized Heber. Fred Harris looked great -- being LRH Pers PR in ASI must be a pretty good job. And was that Neville Potter?

>Thank you for taking the time to write such a thorough reply to
>my post. But I don't think you have said anything to change my
>opinion of David Mayo and those who ally themselves with him.

Wasn't trying to. I was just trying to relate some of my personal experiences with LRH and you were interested enough to post a follow up message.

>You cite some more evidence of L. Ron Hubbard's contempt for
>David Mayo after 1983. This fits the scenario of DM as a traitor
>to L. Ron Hubbard and Scientology - but not his claim to be the
>heir to all Ron's technical hats.

You could be correct about DM (also known as David Miscavige) being a traitor to L. Ron Hubbard and Scientology. But I think that is something you need to judge for yourself when you get all the facts. (We used to call David Miscavige "DM".)

As far as "L. Ron Hubbard's contempt for David Mayo after 1983," I pointed out that information had been sent to L. Ron Hubbard that had caused L. Ron Hubbard to be upset with David and me and several others - -- information which had not been revealed to us and in which we had no opportunity to correct.

>> Are you an "Aussie bleeder?"
>Yes, you're right.

Thought so. I'm an American, but as I'm sure you know, am married to a Kiwi. I couldn't help but notice that the Kiwis have made a pretty good showing -- David Mayo, Brian Livingston, Jeff Walker, Bent Corydon, Graham Berry, ...even Liesa Goodman. Did she really say that Scientology "isn't a turn your other cheek religion"?

And for the Aussies.....they uh, well their boat sank last year, but...I think they've got some spirit too. Why don't you ask head of OSA, Mike Rinder, another Aussie, to show you some of the actual LRH letters to David Mayo, including the April 1982 letter concerning his technical hats. (Actually there were some Aussies -- Tony Dunleavy, former Staff Captain -- left in 1982; Judy Graham, former CS 5 --left, Peter Graham - -- left; the Maces --left ...)

I'm not trying to convince you that David should try to take over LRH's technical hat, I'm just trying to get the truth known, because I think it has been hidden and people have been misinformed. And we have been harassed because of it, which I don't like. I would describe it in stronger terms than "not fun".

David Cooke

Julie Mayo

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